Adapting research projects due to COVID-19 with Léna Prouchet

In this special mini episode, Kelly Preece talks to Léna Prouchet about adpating her research project due to COVID-19.

 

Music credit: Happy Boy Theme Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/

 

Podcast transcript

 

1
00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:15,000
Hello and welcome, R, D And the in betweens, I'm your host, Kelly Preece,

2
00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:32,000
and every fortnight I talk to a different guest about researchers development and everything in between.

3
00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:37,000
Hello and welcome to this special mini episode of R D and the In Betweens.

4
00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:42,000
So one of the projects I'm working on at the moment at work is really trying to gather information

5
00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:47,000
about how people's research projects have had to change due to COVID and how they manage that.

6
00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:54,000
And when I spoke to Lena last week, she talked a little bit about how actually.

7
00:00:54,000 --> 00:01:01,000
She started two weeks before the start of the pandemic, and that changed the nature and scope of her project quite substantially.

8
00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:11,000
So I wanted to take some of these conversations and make just a little special mini episode about how Lena adapted her project.

9
00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:22,000
Yes. So I guess at the beginning we took a really inductive approach to this project.

10
00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:27,000
And I mean, the pandemic happened two weeks after I started the project.

11
00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:33,000
Yes. So the plan at the beginning was to collaborate with Cool Eartch

12
00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:39,000
So from the beginning, I was supposed to work in their offices two days a week so I could get to know them and get to know their projects.

13
00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:44,000
And after the plan was to go to Peru because they have a project there.

14
00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:48,000
So the Latin American project they have are in Peru.

15
00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:54,000
So I was supposed to do this exploratory trip where I would meet with the communities cool earth partner with.

16
00:01:54,000 --> 00:02:01,000
And we would come up with a research topic that would match everybody's interests.

17
00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:07,000
Unfortunately, this was not possible because travelling to Peru was not an option.

18
00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:17,000
So what I did was very much to tighten my links with Cool Earths so trying to understand their project

19
00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:25,000
through Cool Earth itself and not the communities with the plan of going to Peru in the next few months.

20
00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:34,000
So kind of know adapting my approach. And this was made by me attending most of their team meetings.

21
00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:40,000
They have we also have meetings where we only talk about my research and I

22
00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:47,000
also present my research project and how it evolves quite regularly to them,

23
00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:56,000
to their team in the UK. So the team I was talking about are based in Penryn, but also to the country team they have in Peru.

24
00:02:56,000 --> 00:03:04,000
That's really great and it does sound like you've had. A lot of freedom to shape the project.

25
00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:10,000
Whilst I appreciate you know, it in organisational sense,

26
00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:20,000
whilst at the same time being quite directed by not being able to go to Peru and the impact of COVID19,

27
00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:25,000
I wondered if you could say a little bit about that experience,

28
00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:31,000
about coming in with a kind of really clear understanding of what you were gonna do,

29
00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:42,000
go and work and research these communities and then having to kind of really early on shift the focus of the project because of the pandemic.

30
00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:46,000
Yeah. So that was that was a tough experience, especially.

31
00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:51,000
I think it depends on people. And some people, they can adapt very easily.

32
00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:58,000
But I'm a person who really likes to plan things. So I had applied to thisPhDposition.

33
00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:04,000
The research proposal was already written. There was already the research question and the different steps of the research.

34
00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:14,000
And for me, it was very reassuring because I would never have applied to a PhD and come up with a research proposal myself,

35
00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:18,000
because I thought that I was ensured that my topic would be relevant.

36
00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:24,000
So I thought if someone in academia identifies those gaps, it means they're expert on that.

37
00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:27,000
So, I mean, it's it's helpful to do research in this area.

38
00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:33,000
So this was very much my approach or I was only applying to project that were already super defined.

39
00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:43,000
So I arrive and I have all this list. But like a to do list and it's very reassuring, especially since you don't know where to start.

40
00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:52,000
And then two weeks after everything changes. Not only as a result of the pandemic, I think my project would have changed anyways.

41
00:04:52,000 --> 00:05:00,000
As I told you, because I needed you to take more of a business and management approach to it

42
00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:04,000
And so eventually now when I would look at my research proposal, I think that I.

43
00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:09,000
I did it myself. Like I really transformed it.

44
00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:14,000
The only thing that remains from the beginning is the partnership with Cool Earth

45
00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:23,000
And I think that that's the most important part. And I think I feel proud about it because I feel this is something.

46
00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:28,000
Yeah. That was the result of months of work and collaboration and discussions.

47
00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:37,000
And it's actually I have this sense of ownership that I wouldn't have had with the initial proposal.

48
00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:39,000
So in the process of it, it was very hard.

49
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:48,000
I had months where I was coming up with a research question every week because I was stressing out a lot about it and thinking,

50
00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:54,000
okay, I'm never going to find a relevant topic. It's never gonna happen.

51
00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:59,000
I had those phases during the summer, but eventually it worked out.

52
00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:03,000
So the process was tough. It was definitely worth it.

53
00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:06,000
And now, yes, I'm happy.

54
00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:13,000
Although I know it's going to change a lot when I start fieldwork and the approach is going to be totally different in the final work.

55
00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:19,000
But for now, I'm I'm pleased with. With the topic and the approach.

56
00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:26,000
Yeah. And I think there's a number of things that you said in that which I think are really important, which.

57
00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:35,000
What I've been discussing a lot with colleagues, and it's not to in any way downplay the impact of COVID on people's research projects on it,

58
00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:41,000
and it has had varying degrees of impact where kind of people have had to,

59
00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:47,000
you know, shift to doing things, you know, doing interviews or whatever on line to completely,

60
00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:54,000
you know, in in a lot of the ways that you don't like completely redesigning the project.

61
00:06:54,000 --> 00:07:01,000
But it's interesting to hear you talk about that kind of flexibility and adaptability and the importance of that and the

62
00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:10,000
also the kind of slightly philosophical recognition that research is about change fundamentally.

63
00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:16,000
And, you know, when you talk to any researcher, but certainly any, you know, postgraduate researcher like yourself,

64
00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:27,000
where they start when they come in with a proposal and where they leave when they, you know, submit their thesis.

65
00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:32,000
Are always two incredibly different places.

66
00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:41,000
I'm not. And I think that's that's reassuring because, I mean, when you start to feel work is you're not open to what you're seeing,

67
00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:48,000
what people tell you in you have your agenda in mind, in your just telling people, I'm going to do this and this and this.

68
00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:54,000
I mean, it's I don't think that's a very constructive nor ethical approach.

69
00:07:54,000 --> 00:08:04,000
So I think it's good to. It's even necessary to to remain open minded during the entire project, especially in my case,

70
00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:12,000
where I work with indigenous communities, where communities who have been over researched.

71
00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:19,000
And it's interesting because I had the opportunity to talk with an anthropologist that work with Cool Earth last summer.

72
00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:25,000
And she told me about her experience of going to the communities and during the community assembly.

73
00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:32,000
So members of the communities telling her, yeah, but what ways should we take part in this?

74
00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:39,000
It's always the same process of you Western researchers coming on taking our knowledge and leaving and we never hear from you again.

75
00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:50,000
So what are the benefits from Forest? Right. So if you take a more participatory approach and saying, OK, we're gonna remain open,

76
00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:58,000
we're going to construct this research together and we're going to identify your needs and see how the research projects can benefit,

77
00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:05,000
can benefit you, then I think that's that's the best way of doing it.

78
00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:12,000
Yeah. And I think. I think that's really interesting and the issue of of of ethics.

79
00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:18,000
I think that was really interesting and I'll come back to that in a moment. But.

80
00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:24,000
As you were saying that I was thinking about, well, actually, when you do get to do fieldwork now,

81
00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:29,000
the framing and the approach of that field work will be very different.

82
00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:41,000
Having worked within within the organisation in the U.K. for, you know, a year or plus and actually the kind of the way in which that will.

83
00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:54,000
Inform. The way the way that your approach that and I guess the additional context and knowledge and skills and all those sorts of things that you've gained from.

84
00:09:54,000 --> 00:10:01,000
Taking that step back and spending time with the organisation. Yes, I think it also there are some pros and cons.

85
00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:05,000
So, of course, the pros is that. I know.

86
00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:15,000
I know more about what's happening in the community, the relationship between Cool Earth and the communities with UK and also Peruvian team.

87
00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:22,000
So it's very good that I have this communication with Peruvian teams because they are the ones who go to the community more often.

88
00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:27,000
They also have technicians that live with the communities. So I have this insight.

89
00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:32,000
Well, on the other hand, then it gives me a certain perspective and a certain vision.

90
00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:38,000
I don't think that's bad. And I think any researcher has has biases.

91
00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:40,000
You just have to acknowledge that.

92
00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:50,000
And you I mean, from the recommendation that I had in the various articles, I could read about that when you arrive,

93
00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:53,000
even though you're in embedded research within your organisation,

94
00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:57,000
when you arrive to fieldwork in the communities, you're not working for the organisation.

95
00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:04,000
You have to make this clear to community members. Of course, because you have to tell them that you're independent and what they're going to tell you,

96
00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:12,000
you're not going to going to report it in any way. So it's it's important for the trust and the relationships you're you're building with them.

97
00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:20,000
But you also have to try to put aside what you've seen before and really take

98
00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:26,000
this new approach and trying to understand from scratch what's happening there.

99
00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:34,000
And this is very challenging. So the way now I see I'm going to try to to address this is to spend an initial

100
00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:43,000
phase of one month in the communities doing only participant observation to.

101
00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:51,000
Yes, to try to understand how he works there. Also to prove that I'm there, too, to work with them,

102
00:11:51,000 --> 00:12:00,000
but not to to steal anything in terms of of knowledge or practises, really to to build those those trust relationships.

103
00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:07,000
And then from there, from what I've seen during the past, leaving the reservation and from my previous learnings with Cool Earth and the interviews,

104
00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:14,000
I'm going to you then deciding on on follow up methods such as, I don't know, interview or focus groups.

105
00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:27,000
But this will come in second time. So can you say a little bit about how you approached or went about thinking about how to change the project?

106
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:35,000
So, yes, after I think what mattered for me that I tried to get in touch with other PhD students

107
00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:42,000
or postdocs to ask them about this process of reshaping their research topics,

108
00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:47,000
because I know this is something that happens a lot for PhD programmes.

109
00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:55,000
And I thought it was interesting to have the to the experience of my peers and some of them and told me, well,

110
00:12:55,000 --> 00:13:01,000
first of all, think about yourself, because you're going to live with this project for the next now three.

111
00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:03,000
But it was four years at the beginning.

112
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:11,000
So if you don't like it, if you're not happy to to read about it, write about it every morning, then it's not going to work out.

113
00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:18,000
And this is something I had kind of forgotten at the beginning because I really wanted to comply.

114
00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:25,000
And to be sure, I was ticking the boxes. But then, yes, as the months came along, I thought, okay.

115
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:33,000
I have to find this balance and I have to find this topic that also pleases me in something I'm passionate about.

116
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:42,000
So this took really a long time. I started in March and they came up with the final idea in November.

117
00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:46,000
And my supervisor, they had reassured me from the beginning that it was normal.

118
00:13:46,000 --> 00:14:00,000
It was going to take a long time. So you had to be to get lost in the the literature jungle and then see which angle you wanted to to adopt.

119
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:09,000
Thanks, Lena, for that insight into the reorganisation of PPhD project.

120
00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:15,000
Two weeks in, I'd be really interested to talk to other people who've had to change their projects due to COVID.

121
00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:19,000
So please, if you're interested in sharing your experience, good.

122
00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:24,000
The bad, the ugly. Please do get in touch. And that's it for this episode.

123
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,000
Don't forget to, like, rate and subscribe and join me.

124
00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:54,505
Next time we'll be talking to somebody else about researchers development and everything in between.